single trip myki

Myki Q+A: Straight answers to your questions

Updated January 2024

Now that almost all public transport users in Victoria have to use the trouble-plagued Myki ticketing system, people need simple answers to basic questions about it. This page is an effort to explain how the Myki system works, and answer the main questions we are asked.

Where can I get a Myki?

Cards can be obtained online or by phone ( 1800 800 007 6am – midnight daily). You can also get them from Myki Card Vending Machines (which are located at railway stations, some tram platform stops, and some major bus interchanges), from staff at Premium (staffed) stations , or from PTV Hubs at Southern Cross station and 750 Collins Street, Docklands, and in Geelong and Bendigo.

Mykis can also be purchased at many metropolitan retail outlets and some country retail outlets, particularly, but not exclusively, 7-Eleven stores, as well as some Australia Post outlets in major regional centres. See here to get the location details of retailers selling Myki.

Cards can also be bought from most bus drivers in metropolitan Melbourne (except pre-pay-only services such as the 401 and 601 university shuttles), and from bus drivers on the regional city bus networks which use Myki.

Note that only full-fare Mykis can be purchased from Myki vending machines. Concession, child and seniors Mykis must be bought from the other outlets listed above.

How much does getting a Myki card cost?

The cost of a card is $6 full fare, or $3 concession. The purchase price is not refundable. People who become eligible for a free Seniors Myki should apply for one as part of their application for a Seniors Card .

Note that Myki Card Vending Machines only dispense full-fare cards. Concession, child and Seniors cards can be obtained from staffed railway stations, retail outlets, at a PTV Hub , or online. More information on where to get a Myki card .

Where can I add money to my Myki?

You can top up your Myki at all the places listed in the previous section, except for the regional Australia Post shops selling Myki, which only provide cards pre-loaded with some credit.

Mykis can also be topped up by bus drivers (minimum amount $1.00, maximum amount $20).

Why can’t I get a short-term ticket?

With no short-term alternative, anyone wanting to use public transport in Melbourne must have a reusable Myki card with sufficient credit loaded on it, even if they only travel every now and again.

That ridiculous decision means that the PTUA receives complaints about the difficulty occasional travellers have in trying to get or use a ticket.

Even regular public transport users can strike problems. If they forget to have their Myki with them they have to buy another one and put money on it. If their Myki becomes defective, unless they can get to a staffed railway station or PTV Hub, people have to wait for up to ten business days for a new Myki to be issued to them. In the meantime, if they want to travel they have to buy another card and put money on it.

The convenience of short-term tickets is obvious. Before their abolition on major regional city bus networks in mid-April 2013, up to sixty percent of passengers were using them.

How does Myki Money work?

Note: Fares increased by about 5% on 1 January 2024.

You buy a re-usable Myki card and load credit onto it. As you travel you touch on and touch off, and the system will debit your Myki card as you go. Melbourne metropolitan fares are shown in the following table. Regional fares differ from this. For full details of fares see the relevant page of the PTV web site .

Concession fares are 50% of the above prices. Discounts (e.g. Earlybird free travel on trains before 7 a.m.* and Weekend Cap $6.30) apply to Myki Money.

Note that the 2-hour period is exactly that and is timed from the moment you touch on. However, if you touch on after 6 p.m., the 2-hour fare applies until 3 a.m. the next day.

A “daily cap” applies: if you make multiple trips in one day, the system charges you a maximum of two 2-hour segments, e.g. the Daily fare.

If your travel is eligible for the Weekend Saver daily fare (Saturdays, Sundays and public holidays), then Myki charges you a maximum of $6.30 per day ($3.15 concession). If you’re a Senior, the normal daily cap is $4.30, but on weekends, Seniors receive free travel for trips entirely within one or two consecutive zones (including within Zones 1 and 2), and on regional town bus services. Note that even though they are not charged under those circumstances, Seniors are still required to touch on and off.

*Under Earlybird there is actually a 15-minute grace period to allow for late trains, so Myki gives you free travel on trains if you touch on and touch off by 7:15 a.m.

How does Myki Pass work?

 Note: Fares increased by about 5% on 1 January 2024.

Myki Pass is what used to be called a periodical ticket. You buy the normal Myki card and then choose to add credit to turn it into a periodical “pass” for your chosen period — for 7 days, or anything from 28 to 365 days — for the zone or zones you want. Note that these are consecutive days, and are not related to calendar months.

So the price for a “monthly” Pass is based on a particular number of days, not on a calendar month (where the number of days varies).

Current Melbourne metropolitan fares are shown in the following table. Because travel across Zones 1 and 2 costs the same as a Zone 1 fare, Zone 1 passes are not available. Passengers need to purchase a Zone 1 + 2 pass, which costs no extra. Regional fares differ from this. For full details of fares see the relevant page of the PTV web site .

Concession fares are 50% of the above prices. Although only the 30 and 325+ day prices are listed above, you can buy a Pass for anything from 28 to 365 days. For full pricing details see the PTV web site , or the Victorian Fares and Ticketing Manual .

*Note that you can get a discounted Yearly Pass via the PTUA Commuter Club , which provides a more than 9% reduction on the retail price of a 365-day Myki Pass shown above. Commuter Club Mykis are specially-coded Myki cards which are provided free with the discounted Yearly fare.

Can I combine Myki Pass and Myki Money?

Yes. A single Myki card can have a Myki Pass for travel in your usual zone or zones, and also have Myki Money loaded on it for occasional trips into other zones, including V/Line services.

How does Myki work on V/Line?

Myki operates on V/Line’s so-called “commuter” services but the government has decided that Myki will not be used on what are now called “long-distance” railway services – those running beyond Geelong (Waurn Ponds), Ballarat (Wendouree), Bendigo (Eaglehawk or Epsom), Seymour and Traralgon – nor will Myki be used on any V/Line bus services. Those services continue to use paper tickets only.

The Family Traveller concession still requires a paper ticket, regardless of your destination. Available on most V/Line services, the Family Traveller allows one adult to be accompanied free by up to two children (aged 16 years and under) during off-peak times. At all other times, one child can travel free and one child needs to have a valid ticket. See here for more detailed terms and conditions.

V/Line passengers using Myki who travel in more than two zones (and that is the case for most V/Line journeys) must have:

• a Myki Pass for their entire journey and a Myki Money balance of at least $0.00; or
• a sufficient Myki Money on their card to pay for their entire journey; or
• a Myki Pass for part of their journey and sufficient Myki Money to pay for any remaining part of the journey.

V/Line Myki Pass users may travel to a destination beyond the Myki ticket area by purchasing a paper ticket extending their journey. However Myki Money users cannot use such a “hybrid” ticket. If their journey partly includes a service not covered by Myki, a paper ticket to cover their entire journey must be purchased prior to departure.

Under Myki, the concession which allows single (one-way) ticket holders one hour’s free travel in Zones 1 & 2 either side of their V/Line journey, and free Zone 1 & 2 travel all day for all other ticket types, including day return, continues to apply . Myki users must still touch on and off where required, but the Myki system will not charge anything over and above the fare already deducted. However passengers are urged to keep a close eye on their card balance to make sure the system always operates as required.

This same concession also applies to travel on the regional town bus systems on which Myki operates.

Passengers taking long journeys on V/Line commuter services are given additional time to complete their journey without incurring any extra fare. Note: Some increases in this allowance were made on 1 January 2016

• Travel across 3- 5 Zones : 2½ hours allowed
• Travel across 6-8 Zones: 3 hours allowed
• Travel across 9-11 Zones: 3½ hours allowed
• Travel across 12-13 Zones: 4 hours allowed

So a passenger who touches on in Zone 8 at 9.30 a.m. and touches off in Zone 1 at 11.15 a.m. (an 8-zone trip) pays a Zone 1-8 fare which expires at 12.30 p.m.

If touch-on occurs after 6.00 p.m. the fare does not expire until 3.00 a.m. the following day.

The discount fare for off-peak travel, which provides a 30% reduction over the normal fare, is available under Myki for all services timetabled to arrive in, and depart from, Melbourne outside the designated peak times.

To obtain the off-peak concession, V/Line passengers using Myki should not touch on at a station in the morning before the off-peak period commences. In the evening a 15-minute “grace period” applies. Although the off-peak period starts at 18:00 (6 p.m.), a passenger using a V/Line train can touch on after 17:45 (5:45 p.m.) and still obtain the off-peak fare.

For full pricing details see the relevant table in the Victorian Fares and Ticketing Manual .

Does the PTUA provide discounted Yearly tickets under the Commuter Club scheme?

Yes. PTUA members who are regular public transport users can buy discounted Yearly tickets, at about 9% off the retail price, and that includes a free Myki card. You can see full details of the offer here . Commuter Club is also available via some employers.

Note that Commuter Club is only a Melbourne metropolitan program. Even though Myki is used on V/Line commuter services, Public Transport Victoria says there is no plan to extend Commuter Club availability beyond the metropolitan area.

However, passengers travelling to Melbourne from Zone 2 stations which are only served by V/Line trains, such as Tarneit, Wyndham Vale or Melton, are eligible for Commuter Club.

Other V/Line passengers can purchase a 365-day Myki Pass at a heavily discounted rate, which includes up to 40 days free travel.

Can I get a refund if I no longer need the Myki Pass I purchased?

You can apply for a refund of a partly-used Myki Pass or an unused Myki Pass, as well as unused Myki Money. You can either do that by filling out an online application , or by completing the paper Myki Refund & Reimbursement Form . However refunds are not available on expired Passes, and you cannot get a refund of the purchase price of a Myki ($6 or $3 concession) .

Note that if you use the paper from you must return your Myki card with it. In that case, you will need to have another Myki card in order to travel, because of the government’s stupid decision not to include the planned short-term ticket in the Myki system.

The refunded amount can either be sent to you as a cheque or the unused funds can be transferred to another Myki. You can also convert Myki Pass credit to Myki Money, although an amount over $250 can only be paid by cheque.

It takes up to 10 business days for a Myki Pass to be converted to Myki Money and up to 21 business days for cheque refunds to be processed.

Can Myki be used to track my movements?

You can choose to register your Myki, or not, as you wish.

It is possible to get a card completely anonymously from Myki vending machines or over the counter. Unregistered cards get access to the same fares.

If you register your card you are protected against theft or the loss of the card, because you can report the loss, have your Myki deactivated, and have the remaining credit balance transferred to a new card. You can also set a registered card to be topped up automatically with money from your bank account.

Public Transport Victoria (PTV) has published a privacy policy which goes into some detail about when they might provide someone’s travel data to authorities. You can read it here .

Can someone else use my Myki?

It is perfectly legal for other people to use your Myki, provided that it only has Myki Money loaded on it. However you are not allowed to share your card if Myki Pass is loaded on it.

Does the credit on my card expire if I haven’t used it for 90 days?

No it does not. This idea is widespread but completely false.

However, if you top up your card using the Myki web site, and do not “collect” that money onto your card (e.g. touch your card on a reader, or check the balance at a vending machine) within 90 days, the system “archives” the top-up amount (and only the top-up amount), meaning that you cannot add that money immediately to the balance on your card.

Your archived top-up will be re-activated, and sent out again to readers and vending machines, when you use your card on the system again (for example, touch it at a reader, or use it at a vending machine), and you will then be able to “collect” the archived amount onto the card.

Note however, that this reactivation process can take up to 24 hours, so if your balance is too low to allow you to travel, you will need to top up your card immediately (for instance at a vending machine) if you want to use it there and then.

Can I travel if my Myki has a negative or debit balance?

Only in certain circumstances. Your Myki must have a balance of at least $0.00 (i.e. not negative) for you to be able to touch on, but you can go into negative balance during the journey if you are only travelling in one or two zones, which is the case in metropolitan Melbourne and on regional city bus systems.

However, most V/Line journeys will take you through more than two zones, and if that is the case, you must have sufficient credit on your Myki to cover the whole journey (see “How does Myki work on V/Line?” above).

Note that if you break the journey during which your Myki goes into negative balance, any other touch on will be refused, even if the two-hour travel period has not expired.

It is also important to note that even though the Myki Pass on your card may be valid for travel, you cannot commence a journey using Myki Pass if the Myki Money balance on that card is negative. For your Myki Pass to be valid, your Myki Money balance must be at least $0.00.

How do I touch on and touch off?

Touch on your Myki ticket at a reader as you enter the station, or as you board the tram or bus. Touch off the ticket at a reader as you leave the station, or leave the tram or bus.

You must place the ticket flat on the reader. Don’t “swipe” it, or move it around, because the reader will take longer to respond or not read the card at all.

The card must be within about half a centimetre of the reader, but preferably touching it. It will usually work from inside a wallet or bag, especially if the Myki ticket is in the closest pocket, but this isn’t guaranteed. It will often not work if you have other cards in your wallet which use similar technology (an RFID chip), because that confuses the reader.

One of the major problems with the system is that the response times of Myki card readers are inconsistent and often too slow, particularly in buses — sometimes readers respond in under a second, but too often they take a good deal longer. Although new Myki barriers with faster response times have been installed at some stations, it is ridiculous that the problem is still with us ten years after Myki was first introduced.

Do I really need to touch on every time?

You need to touch on every time you enter a station, tram or bus to ensure your ticket is valid for travel, even if you have already touched on somewhere else for the particular journey you are undertaking.

In reality, you must touch on the first time you use a ticket for a particular journey, to set its expiry date and time. Not doing so is fare evasion.

There is an exception to that, however. You don’t have to touch on or off if you travel on a tram entirely within the “Free Tram Zone” which covers Melbourne’s CBD and Docklands. There is a map of the Free Tram Zone here .

But if your journey starts or finishes outside the boundaries of the Free Tram Zone, you must touch on your Myki in the normal way to make sure you have a valid ticket.

You must touch on when boarding a bus, even if your ticket is already valid for that journey, so that the bus driver knows you have a valid ticket. You must also touch on when boarding at railway stations if your destination is a gated station, otherwise the gates at your destination may not let you out, and you may have to queue for staff assistance.

You should also touch on and touch off if you are travelling on a Myki Pass outside the zone(s) you have paid for.

Do I really need to touch off every time?

Except on trams (see below), the official line is yes. If you don’t touch-off, you may get charged a default fare, which may be more than you’d otherwise pay.

The default fare is charged when the system doesn’t know where you got off the train/tram/bus, and it assumes you might have gone to the end of the line (on a tram/bus) or to the last stop of the longest line on the system (metropolitan trains).

In other words if you don’t touch-off on buses and trains the Myki system may assume you took a two-zone trip, and charge you for it. If this is the correct fare anyway (for instance you’ve travelled on a train from the CBD to a Zone 2 station) then you will not be charged anything extra if you do not touch-off, and so you can choose not to do so.

As noted above, you still need to touch on and off if you are travelling on a tram entirely within the Zone 1/2 overlap, if you want to ensure that you pay the cheaper Zone 2 fare.

The default fare does not apply to Myki Pass if you touched on (started your journey) in your nominated zone. In other words, if you have a weekly/monthly/yearly Pass on your Myki card, there is no need to touch off when travelling in the zone(s) covered by the Pass.

The government says it gets useful statistics about travel patterns if people touch on and touch off every time. However, they supposedly got useful statistics with the old Metcard system, as well as through manual surveys, but that hasn’t stopped services getting very crowded due to a lack of forward planning and investment over the past few years.

Why don’t I have to touch off on trams?

There was an obvious likelihood of congestion on trams resulting from the number of passengers trying to touch on and off at busy stops. Therefore, all tram routes were modified to be within Zone 1 (areas formerly in Zone 2 only are now all within the Zone 1/2 overlap), and so you do not have to touch off on a tram if you are only travelling within Zone 1, because the default fare on trams is a Zone 1 fare only.

However if you travel on a tram entirely within in the Zone 1/2 overlap, which only occurs right at the end of routes 75, 86 and 109, you do need to touch off before you alight to ensure that you are only charged the cheaper Zone 2 fare.

Do I get charged for another 2-hours if I touch off after the expiry time?

No. Your Myki ticket is valid as long as you touch on at a station, or board the tram or bus, before the expiry time.

I heard weekly/monthly/yearly Passes aren’t valid on weekends.

That is not true. They are valid on weekends, but only in the zones you’ve paid for.

A single-zone weekly/monthly/yearly Metcard used to be valid in both Melbourne zones on Saturdays and Sundays. That benefit has been withdrawn under Myki. The government argues that is necessary in order to be consistent with regional areas, and yet no regional area has the $6.30 weekend daily fare cap which is available in Melbourne.

The result is that Myki Pass users must pay extra if they travel into another zone. But their total fare will attract the $6.30 weekend/public holiday cap, and what has already been paid towards that is taken into account.

Why does the information displayed on the reader vanish too quickly for me to read it?

The information showing your card balance, and the amount deducted for your journey, will be displayed for as long as you hold your card to the reader, so hold it up for longer if you want to check that information. However, some of the new card readers on railway station barriers do not display any information about the status of the card.

You can also use a Myki Card Vending Machine or a Myki Check (blue-colured) machine to find out the status of your card.

I’ve heard that a Myki card has an expiry date.

The validity of a Myki card expires four years after purchase, although the expiry date is not shown on the card itself. Note that the expiry date is set when the card is first loaded with credit, so if you buy a pre-loaded card that has been lying around for a while before you bought it, the expiry date may be a lot less than four years away.

You can find out when your card expires by checking it on a Myki Card Vending Machine or blue Myki Check machine. These are situated at railway stations, some tram platform stops, and some major bus interchanges. You can also find out a card’s expiry date by ringing 1800 800 007 and quoting the card number.

If you have registered your Myki you can find out the expiry date by logging on to your account via the PTV website . People who have registered their Myki will be reminded of the imminent expiry by PTV before the expiry date.

When your Myki expires you can go to any staffed railway station or PTV Hub to get a free replacement card. The remaining balance on your old card will be transferred to the new one. If your Myki has a negative balance, you will have to top-up to a positive balance as part of the replacement process.

If your expired Myki is registered, the replacement card will also be automatically registered. However, if you have auto top up linked to your expired Myki, you will have arrange auto top up again for your new card.

Does Myki Money always give me the best fare?

Provided everything works correctly, it does give you the best daily fare, by charging you the cheapest possible fare for each trip, and upgrading it automatically, for instance from a 2-hour Zone 1, to a Daily Zone 1+2 — whatever is cheapest for your day’s travel.

But if you use it every day, the system does not automatically upgrade you to a cheaper 7-day Pass or a 30-day Pass etc. Myki Pass must be pre-loaded to attract the cheaper periodical fare.

I heard you have to pay extra if the train is late.

No, not on trains, but you may be affected if you want to make use of the 2-hour fare and you catch trams and buses .

Under Myki, your ticket is valid as long as you start your trip (that is, touch on at the station, or as you board the tram or bus) before the 2-hour travel time expires.

This is only a problem when using trams and buses, because you only touch on as you board. When using trains you can enter the platform and touch on before the expiry time, no matter how late the train you are catching might be.

If you are going to travel for more than 2 hours it makes no difference to you, but if you are trying to make a couple of short trips using a bus or tram in a single 2-hour period, with no other travel that day, you will be charged the daily fare if the bus or tram arrives late, after your 2-hours has expired.

What’s the use of compensation being paid as Myki Money, when I have a Myki Pass?

Monetary compensation for poor service delivery can only be claimed if you have travelled for 10 or more days with a Myki Pass that is for 28 days or longer.

When Yarra Trams , Metro Trains or V/Line miss their monthly performance targets, you can claim compensation. Given the electronic nature of the Myki system, it is ridiculous that getting compensation is a manual process, involving filling in a form and posting it. It seems obvious that the system is designed to discourage passengers from getting the compensation they are owed.

Compensation is paid as the Myki Money equivalent of the zones covered by the Pass, rather than extending the duration of the Pass.

There are several ways to make use of the Myki Money compensation:

• Use it after your Pass expires. Note, however, that if you have another Pass loaded on your card, the Myki system will always use that first if it is valid for your trip.
• Use it for travel in other zones, including V/Line journeys.
• Request that the compensation amount is added to a different Myki card, such as a family member’s card, or a second card that you use. This option is on the form.
• Pay for your next Myki Pass using Myki Money. This is done by putting enough Myki Money on your card to pay for the Pass, then choosing the option on vending machine to buy a Pass with Myki Money. Unfortunately this option appears to only be available from vending machines.

Is Myki switching us to distance-based fares?

No. The current zone system is being retained.

Hong Kong and Singapore and some other cities use fares based on how many kilometres you travel. Myki does not include this change and fares remain almost identical to those under Metcard, based on the zones (which will now spread across Victoria) and duration (2-hour, daily, etc.) of travel.

The PTUA believes that distance-based charging has some disadvantages − it may lead to higher fares, and it is quite confusing, because you might not know how much you’ll be charged before you travel.

How do ticket inspectors and V/Line conductors check tickets?

There is little information printed on the Myki card itself, and no obvious way of telling whether you have validated correctly or not. Authorised Officers (ticket inspectors) and V/Line conductors use hand-held devices that can read the cards.

Has Myki slowed things down?

Yes, in some situations.

Station exits during the evening peak have become congested as train-loads of people queue to touch off. The unacceptably slow and inconsistent response times of card readers do not help in this regard. To ease the problem, more readers have been added at stations, new or widened station exits have been provided, and new barriers with faster card readers have been installed at some stations.

Buses should have benefited from faster boarding times but Myki readers on buses are notorious for their slow and inconsistent response times.

The government’s decision not to allow single-use tickets to be purchased might have speeded-up bus operations (although quite a few bus passengers top-up frequently with small amounts as an alternative), but that is at the expense of occasional users who do not have a Myki, or passengers who have forgotten to have their Myki with them.

Touching off has been made optional on trams, to avoid delays (see above). Whether delays occur depends to a great extent on how quickly the readers respond, and how many there are. It is worth noting that London’s buses and trams were both switched to a flat fare system, requiring no touch-off, because delays during disembarking were causing problems.

Does Myki work properly?

Virtually every aspect of Myki’s introduction has been poorly handled. The PTUA has flagged a number of design and implementation problems with Myki that need fixing , and we are continuing to give feedback to Public Transport Victoria.

The biggest drawback with the Myki system is the state government’s unexplained decision not to make single-use tickets available, meaning that every public transport user must have a Myki card, loaded with sufficient credit, to be able to travel. This makes things extremely difficult for tourists, for new and occasional public transport users, or for passengers who have problems with their Myki, and it will be a further source of fare evasion.

As noted above, the other major and persistent problem with the operation of Myki is that response times of card readers are inconsistent and often too slow − sometimes they respond in under a second, but very often they take a good deal longer. That is unacceptable, and it has been allowed to continue for far too long.

As soon as Myki began operating, the PTUA asked that different sounds be introduced for a touch on and a touch off. Instead of that, we got the totally unnecessary introduction of a double beep for concession passengers.

Opportunities for buying and topping up cards are still too limited, especially for tram and bus users.

There have been a number of instances of people mistakenly “touching on” at blue Myki Check machines, rather than the proper Myki card readers, and then being fined for not having touched on. We have asked PTV to make changes to the relevant hardware and software which will make this less likely to occur.

Watch the system very carefully to ensure you’re being charged correctly. Keep a close eye on the Myki readers as you use them, check your transactions on the Myki Check machines (the blue machines in stations and some trams stops) at vending machines and/or via the PTV web site, and ring 1800 800 007 or contact PTV online if you suspect you have been overcharged.

Was it worth the money?

Probably not. Although the Myki system brings some benefits , including better access to cheap fares, these are eclipsed by the enormous cost of the system.

Few passengers wanted a new ticket system, and the PTUA argued that for a fraction of the cost, either the previous Metcard system could have been updated, or a cheaper Smartcard system bought from elsewhere. The money saved could have been spent on more staff, trains, trams and buses. But the change has happened, so we’re providing feedback to Public Transport Victoria to try and improve the outcome for passengers.

Further questions?

Email office at ptua.org.au with your questions. We’ll endeavour to find out the answers and post them back here.

If you want to read all the fine print yourself, it’s contained in the Victorian Fares and Ticketing Manual . Be warned, the Manual is over 100 pages long.

Public Transport Victoria has posted some useful information on its web site, which you can read here .

You can ring PTV for information, on 1800 800 007 (6 a.m. – midnight daily).

You can also go to a PTV Hub to get assistance. There is one near the Collins Street entrance of Southern Cross Station (pictured). There is another Hub on the ground floor of the PTV headquarters building at 750 Collins Street, Docklands, about 500 metres from Southern Cross station. That Hub can perform more operations than the one at Southern Cross. For example the Collins Street Hub includes the Pass Office, which issues the various forms of free travel passes which are available on the public transport network. There are also PTV Hubs in Geelong and Bendigo.

What is the PTUA anyway?

Founded in 1976, the Public Transport Users Association is the recognised consumer organisation representing passengers of all forms of public transport.

We are a non-profit, voluntary organisation, with no political affiliations. If you want to help support our work, please join us . You get five newsletters per year, as well as access to cheap Yearly tickets , and you’ll be helping the campaign for better public transport in Melbourne and around Victoria.

Victorians won’t miss myki, but what will ‘best practice’ transport ticketing look like?

Honorary Professor of Planning, The University of Queensland

Disclosure statement

Neil G Sipe has received funding from the Australia Research Council.

University of Queensland provides funding as a member of The Conversation AU.

View all partners

With fewer people using public transport and more working from home due to the COVID pandemic, public transport agencies need to do everything they can to encourage more people to use their services. An essential step is to make the ticketing and payment process as easy as possible. That means it needs to keep pace with emerging technology and trends.

Some agencies, such as Singapore’s Land Transport Authority , have done so. Others have not – the myki card system in Victoria falls into this category. The state government has announced a “ best practice ” system will replace myki when its operator’s contract expires later this year.

Myki represented state-of-the-art technology when it replaced paper tickets a decade or so ago. It’s the ticketing system for travelling on trains, trams and buses in Melbourne, on trains from Melbourne to certain regional destinations, and on buses in major regional centres. However, the system now clearly needs to be updated .

This article outlines what a “best practice” replacement should look like. The new system must overcome the limitations that have emerged with myki, add the best features developed in other cities and build in the flexibility to keep up with the evolution of urban transport.

Read more: Electric on-demand public transport is making a difference in Auckland – now it needs to roll out further

What’s wrong with myki?

The first problem with myki is its restricted payment options. It does not allow direct payment with a credit or debit card when getting onto a train, tram or bus.

In 2019, the system was updated to allow direct payment for a trip using a digital myki on Android phones, but not Apple phones. This means about half of Victoria’s potential public transport users cannot use their phones to pay for their trip. (Nationally, the split is 54% Android and 46% Apple – no city-level data are available.)

While Apple users can now automatically top up their myki card using their phones, they must still buy a physical myki card for $6, or $3 concession.

Second, while not directly impacting users, the myki terminals at public transport stations and on buses and trams use 3G wireless technology. This wireless network is due to be shut down in June 2024. Terminals will have to be updated to the 5G network.

Third, it is not easy for visitors to Victoria to understand the system. Before they can board public transport, they must first stop to buy a myki card for $6 (available at only some stations and retail outlets ) and add money to cover the fare.

Read more: We subscribe to movies and music, why not transport?

What is current best practice?

Contactless payment with a credit card, smartphone or smart watch is becoming standard practice on public transport. The pandemic accelerated this trend because operators wanted to minimise contact points associated with either cash payments or buying a physical ticket or card.

Two large public transport systems in London and Amsterdam are now contactless and cashless. In Australia, Sydney and Adelaide have contactless payment in place.

Sydney’s example is worth noting because, while upgrading to contactless payment options, it has maintained the use of the Opal card as well as the option of buying a single-trip ticket. Thus, Sydney has kept the payment options as broad as possible so as not to disadvantage any potential users. Many systems lack this flexibility — particularly those that have gone contactless and cashless.

Something that is often overlooked, but is a critical feature of exemplary public transport systems, is a well-designed seamless website or app that supports the payment system. Infrastructure Victoria highlighted this issue in its report, Better Public Transport Fares for Melbourne .

And how will public transport evolve?

Mobility as a service (MaaS) is one of the emerging trends in public transport. The goal is to allow users to have access to a range of transport options in a single app. However, COVID has slowed its progress .

Read more: All your transport options in one place: why mobility as a service needs a proper platform

Most of the cities that have implemented mobility as a service are in Europe. They include: Vienna, Austria; Antwerp, Belgium; Turku, Finland; the West Midlands region in Britain; the Flanders region of Belgium; and all of Switzerland. Tokyo also has it.

However, many cities across the globe are hopeful of implementing the idea. Among them is Sydney, which is trialling the bundling of transport services – including taxis, ride-share vehicles and e-bikes – in one transaction. Public transport agencies are attempting to provide access to the full range of traditional public transport (trains, trams, buses and ferries) and non-traditional options (taxis, e-bikes, e-scooters, rideshares and so on).

Another innovation being trialled in Singapore is “hands free” ticketing . It uses radio frequency identification technology to detect a commuter’s fare card when passing through a sensor. This will do away with the need for pausing to tap on with a phone, card or watch.

Read more: For Mobility as a Service (MaaS) to solve our transport woes, some things need to change

3 things Victoria’s new system must deliver

Victoria’s next public transport ticketing contract should deliver the following:

multiple payment options, including smartphones, smart watches, bank cards and single-ticket cash purchases, so users who don’t have smart devices or credit cards aren’t disadvantaged (though this represents a small minority of riders, they are often the most dependent on public transport)

5G wireless technology to connect the ticketing network

the flexibility to accommodate a MaaS model that allows third-party integration with a single interface where users can pay for all their transport options.

Only a system that does all of the above will deliver on the promise of a “best practice” replacement for myki.

• Public transport
• Urban transport
• Transport policy
• Mobility as a service
• Better Cities

Project Officer, Student Volunteer Program

Audience Development Coordinator (fixed-term maternity cover)

Lecturer (Hindi-Urdu)

Director, Defence and Security

Opportunities with the new CIEHF

Victoria / Melbourne Transport

Victoria / Melbourne Public Transport

• Journey Planner
• Melbourne Check Points
• metro trains
• yarra trams
• melbourne buses
• 2023 Myki money
• Railway Stations
• Melbourne Airport
• Universities
• Park + Ride
• Sporting venues
• Public Transport
• showgrounds

If you travel often, you can buy consecutive days with a myki Pass. Choose where you’ll be travelling and how many days you need. You can buy a myki Pass for 7 days or anywhere between 28 and 365 days.

V/Line commuter train fares for travel to/from Zone 1

Myki pass * multiply this daily rate by the number of days required to calculate the myki pass cost. when you buy a myki pass for between 326 and 365 days you only pay for 325 days, receiving up to 40 days free., all other v/line commuter train fares.

What if Opal and Myki became one? It’d help more of us than you’d think

Analysis What if Opal and Myki became one? It’d help more of us than you’d think

Melburnians know Myki, Sydneysiders know Opal. These two electronic ticketing systems for public transport may be streets ahead of what they replaced, but are now decidedly old-fashioned compared with systems elsewhere in the world.

In the Netherlands, you can buy a single card and use it on public transport anywhere in the country. In Japan, you can buy a card to travel on the majority of public transport options.

Why can't Australian public transport work the same, starting with Myki and Opal?

These two systems cover about 40 per cent of Australia's population. Melbourne and Sydney are the two cities most visited by international and domestic tourists, and travel between the two cities is one of  the world's busiest  routes.

Research shows the easier it is to use public transport, such as through  integrated ticketing , the more people will use it. It stands to reason more travellers will use public transport if they can use the card they already have in their wallet or purse. Few Australians hold more than the card from their home city.

Upgrading Opal and Myki

Now is the time to do something about this, before NSW and Victoria spend hundreds of millions of dollars upgrading (and reduplicating) Opal and Myki.

The NSW government committed almost  $570 million  in its last budget to upgrade Opal. The Victorian government is  looking at options to upgrade Myki  and will sign a new contract with an operator this year. The current contract is worth about $100 million a year. How much it will commit to upgrading the system is still unknown, but it is reasonable to assume it's comparable to NSW.

You can only imagine the duplication happening in these parallel processes.

Moving to a system as in the Netherlands and Japan is not without its challenges. It means overcoming the same constitutional arrangements and state-based cultures that once led to incompatible rail gauges, and why we have state-based driver's licences and vehicle registrations.

But the potential benefits of national integrated ticketing include lower ticketing costs and ease of transport access, leading to better service provision, cheaper fares and overall greater public transport use.

Implementing account-based systems

Both NSW and Victorian governments are touting the benefits of moving from their wallet-based systems to what are known as "account-based systems".

Instead of buying a standalone card (which you or anyone else can use), account-based systems tie your card (or credit card, or "tappable" device) to your travel account. You can pay using a credit card in some cities in Australia (Melbourne isn't one of them — one reason for the Myki upgrade) but they are just a payment mechanism, without other benefits.

Account-based ticketing brings with it a far more powerful back-end system upgrade, providing better fare and payment flexibility and data collection.

Most importantly it can enable greater integration between transport operators. Data collected on how and when people use public transport enables operators to better plan and integrate services. For travellers combining several transport legs, it could mean cheaper fares. For operators in the system, it could open new ways of working together to make better journeys for passengers. This greater collaboration may also lead to benefits we can't yet predict.

Yet there appears to be no attempt to discuss collaboration across state lines.

Travellers want compatible systems

Our  research , using a survey of 715 people in across all capital cities (except Darwin), indicates intercity travellers would choose public transport over private car options at a ratio of about two to one, if given the option to use their home card when travelling in another city.

It may be argued public transport in Australia is very different to the Netherlands or Japan, notably in terms of population densities. But similar single account systems are also under development in New Zealand, Britain and California.

So how do we get a common system?

Constitutional arrangements are not insurmountable. And while there are differences between Australia's cities, they are not so wildly different that ticketing needs differ. The basics of tapping on and off for most trips are the same. Fares are programmable.

The greater challenge will be in overcoming the institutional inertia of state-based bureaucracies.

The first step is for the states (and territories) to talk to one another and develop a common understanding of the benefits of collaboration. Starting with NSW and Victoria makes sense, though it is also worth starting a conversation about a national system.

The challenge will be for states to look past their immediate self-interest, and for transport ministers to agree on the same policy directions.

But this is all quite possible. They've done it before, as evidenced by the fact you can now get a train from Melbourne to Sydney without needing to change at the border. Though that did require some federal intervention.

James Bushell is a PhD candidate and Research Associate at the Institute of Transport and Logistics Studies, University of Sydney. This piece first appeared on The Conversation .

• X (formerly Twitter)
• Public Transport
• State and Territory Government

• Plan trip/Buy tickets
• Live service updates

Ticketing & fares

If your travel spans multiple transport operators and ticket types, for example, a long distance V/Line service and PTV buses, trams or trains, you are encouraged to obtain a single ticket for your entire journey. Plan your journey and buy your tickets using the V/Line Journey Planner tool .

What ticket do I need?

Find out more about myki and paper tickets on V/Line services by clicking the headings below.

• Geelong / Waurn Ponds                     
• Ballarat / Wendouree
• Bendigo / Epsom / Eaglehawk

How do I buy a Mobile myki?

Instructions.

• Download Google Pay TM  
• Follow the instructions within Google PayTM to set up your payment card
• Go to Passes. Tap the blue + Pass button and select Travel card. Choose myki 
• Choose myki Money or myki Pass
• Choose your fare product: Full fare, Child, Senior or General concession (interstate senior)
• Finish the transaction and you're ready to travel!

Want more information?

Where can I buy a myki card?

• at staffed V/Line stations between Melbourne and Geelong, Ballarat, Bendigo, Traralgon and Seymour
• at myki machines at some V/Line stations - check your  closest station’s myki facilities  
• at staffed Metro stations
• online at  ptv.vic.gov.au
• by calling 1800 800 007
• at the PTV Hub at Southern Cross Station.

Where can I top up my myki?

• online at  ptv.vic.gov.au  (online top up may take around 45 minutes to process)
• via the PTV App
• with instant top up via the PTV App
• by calling 1800 800 007 (allow at least 24 hours for processing)
• at myki machines at some V/Line stations,  check your closest station’s myki facilities
• at over 800 retailers where you see the myki sign. To find the nearest retail outlet, visit the  PTV website

How do I use the myki card when travelling?

How much does a myki card cost, can i purchase pre-loaded myki cards onboard, if i have a myki pass, can i travel to long distance stations beyond zones i’ve paid for.

If you are a frequent traveller, you can purchase a seven day or 28–365 day myki pass , which lowers the daily cost of your travel. If you want to travel beyond the myki zone and require a paper ticket, you can still take advantage of the regional fare cap. Please visit a staffed myki station and speak with station staff to book the rest of your journey and ensure you pay the lowest fare.

Paper tickets

• Maryborough
• Warrnambool

How do I get a paper ticket?

How much will my journey cost.

The price of your journey will differ depending on your origin and destination. If you are travelling on a long distance service or outside of the myki zone, use the V/Line Journey Planner tool to calculate your fare and book your travel. If you are travelling within a myki zone, check the fare tables on the PTV website . Fares for travel on all Government owned or operated public transport across Victoria are capped at the same price as a metropolitan ticket. Once you reach the fare cap, you will not be charged any more for your travel on the same day when booking in the same transaction, or when using your myki card for travel within the myki zone. Despite where you are travelling across the V/Line network, you will need a valid ticket for your journey, even if you have previously reached the fare cap on a different journey on the same day. Interstate V/Line destinations may attract an additional daily interstate travel fee. This is paid on top of the fare cap. Please find more detail below.

Full fare and concession

Peak and off-peak travel, peak travel is defined by:.

• Services that arrive in Melbourne before 9am on weekdays; or 
• Services that depart from Melbourne between 4pm and 6pm on weekdays.
• ​For V/Line services, Melbourne is defined as Flinders Street, Southern Cross, North Melbourne and Richmond stations.

Off-peak travel is defined by:

• All other services, including public holidays and weekends.

Interstate travel

• Mount Gambier
• Adelaide City 
• Adelaide Hills 
• Mount Barker 
• Bermagui 
• Bodalla 
• Batemans Bay 
• Canberra 
• Coleambally 
• Coonalpyn 
• Cobargo 
• Dalmeny 
• Darlington Point 
• Griffith 
• Gundagai 
• Geranium 
• Jabuk 
• Murray Bridge 
• Murrumbateman 
• Moruya 
• Narooma 
• Nimmitabel 
• Cooma 
• Peake 
• Sherlock 
• Tarcutta 
• Tailem Bend 
• Tintinara 
• Tuross 

Extra travel included

Regional town buses.

• Geelong 
• North Geelong 
• South Geelong 
• Corio 
• North Shore 
• Marshall 
• Waurn Ponds 
• Ballarat 
• Wendouree 
• Kangaroo Flat 
• Bendigo 
• Eaglehawk 
• Epsom 
• Wallan 
• Kilmore East 
• Seymour 
• Traralgon 
• Morwell 

Reservations

Reserved seating is available on V/Line train services to and from Albury, Bairnsdale, Shepparton, Swan Hill and Warrnambool. These services operate with a mixture of reserved and unreserved carriages. You can purchase a reserved ticket, which guarantees you a specific seat in the reserved carriage(s), or an unreserved ticket, which allows you to travel in the unreserved carriage(s) onboard these services. Reservations are required on most V/Line coach services. Passengers can find reserved services shaded in timetables. In the V/Line Journey Planner tool, reserved coach services are shown with an ‘R’ for ‘Reserved’, and train services with reserved carriages are shown with an ‘RC’ for ‘Reserved carriage(s)’. Reservations are not required on trains to and from all other destinations on the V/Line network, including Geelong, Ballarat, Bendigo, Seymour and Traralgon but you still require a valid myki or unreserved paper ticket to travel.

Making changes to your travel

For reserved services.

• call 1800 800 007; or
• visit a V/Line station or ticket outlet near you.

For unreserved services

Refunds, lost or stolen tickets.

Information about myki refunds can be found on the PTV website .

You can receive a full refund for single or return tickets if you are unable to travel as long as you apply before the departure date of your service. No administration fee applies.

The easiest way to apply for a refund is to visit your closest V/Line station . Alternatively, please complete an enquiry using the  online feedback form , phone 1800 800 007 or send a completed refund application form, along with your paper tickets, to the address specified below:

Lost or stolen tickets

• Enclose the original ticket with your refund application.
• We cannot accept responsibility for applications which are lost in the post.
• Posted tickets must arrive before the departure date printed on the ticket.
• V/Line ticket agents can only refund tickets bought from their agencies.

Compensation for delays and performance

Family traveller ticket, group travel.

• 12 or more customers travelling together on V/Line coach services
• 20 or more customers travelling together on V/Line train services
• Group travel is charged at concession fares, which is approximately 50 per cent cheaper than the standard weekday adult fares and approximately 30 per cent cheaper on weekends.

Fares & general info

• Privacy policy
• Terms of use
• V/Line Corporate

Ten years of Myki in Melbourne

• Post date Mon 30 December 2019
• 26 Comments on Ten years of Myki in Melbourne

Happy birthday Myki!

Yesterday marked ten years since the Myki system’s implementation in Melbourne. It was switched on for Melbourne trains on 29th December 2009 .

The roll-out and first ten years of operation ended up costing a whopping $1.5 billion. The only Australian system of comparable size, NSW’s Opal system, was a little bit cheaper , but is still the same order of magnitude. My conclusion is that the size of the system (number of devices, and all the supporting infrastructure) is a more important determinant of cost than anything else.

Currently there’s a $700 million, 7 year contract in place to keep Myki running and for the current round of upgrades.

(If you’re wondering, the $100 million a year of costs is more than covered by fare revenue, which the PTV Annual Report says topped $900 million in 2018-19.)

After a very shaky start, and a long protracted roll-out that took more than four years (from regional town buses in early 2009 to V/Line in 2013), the Myki system has improved over time – and I suspect most passengers have become accustomed to its quirks.

But there definitely is still room for improvement, even without wholesale re-engineering of the system.

How can Myki be made better?

Here are a few issues that should still be fixed:

Passes are confusing , and can result in passengers who travel every day paying more than necessary. This should be replaced by a Myki Money weekly cap , which was originally promised . (Monthly too? Perhaps.)

With readers often awkwardly located , touch-on and touch-off sounds should be made different so it is easier to identify that the card has been touched successfully, and in the intended manner. Sounds should also be consistent across Myki reader types, and made louder so they are easily audible in noisy environments. (There’s no need for them to beep once or twice depending on the type of ticket. Nobody uses this.)

Myki reader speeds are inconsistent. New faster readers have been deployed at many stations, and increasingly on buses and trams as well, which is a big improvement. (Thank you, open architecture .)

It would be good to know if this roll-out is going to eventually replace all of the older readers. Their response times were never acceptably fast and consistent – and are probably why the terminology changed from “ scan ” to “touch”.

The new readers either don’t display the card balance/expiry , or display it so small that it can barely be read. I know they’re trying to ensure people don’t dawdle at station gates, but some people now never see their card Pass expiry.

Myki Mobile for iPhone would be a big plus – take-up on Android seems to have been reasonably good, despite some glitches, but making it available for iPhone mean almost all mobile phone users have the option.

If this can be achieved, arguably being able to use credit cards directly on the system (as in London and Sydney, both using variants of the same system) becomes less important.

Fare anomalies need to be fixed . This is not strictly a Myki issue, but the result of years of governments of both stripes fiddling with the fare system – first getting rid of zone 3, then making zone 1 and 2 an almost flat fare. The result is that Melbourne to Lara (58km) costs $4.40; to the next stop at Corio (64km) is $12 (peak). That’s completely ridiculous, and encourages people to drive across Geelong to Lara station before catching their train.

Expansion to the rest of V/Line would be useful, to make train usage beyond the commuter belt easier. This was originally the plan, but was “de-scoped” by the Baillieu government in 2011 . I suspect there are probably issues getting Myki to handle First Class and seat reservations, which is why it was decided it was all too hard.

Free mode. Myki readers need this for the now regular bus replacement operations, to prevent issues with passengers touching-on when they don’t need to, and for regular free travel periods such as Christmas Day and New Year’s Eve. (They might still need to be partly functional to cater for touch-off for people ending their trips, for instance just after 6pm when free rides start on New Year’s Eve.)

Tickets for occasional users need to be easier to get . Single use tickets were also originally planned for the system, and de-scoped in 2011 , along with tram vending machines.

Admittedly there’s some benefit from not having single use tickets – it reduces litter and waste, and encourages repeat use – but only if you can convince people to get a card in the first place. If not, the system remains a barrier to new public transport users.

Remember, concession cards can’t be obtained through the vending machines, which are the only option at unstaffed stations.

Are the cards sufficiently available for tourists? Can the refund system be improved?

And what to do about the lack of touch-on opportunities for tram users?

All this becomes less important if both major mobile phone operating systems can use Mobile Myki.

Fix the web site . Most of it (including the overall look and feel) hasn’t been changed since it was originally released. Still the same tiny fonts and non-mobile-friendly layout.

And there’s idiotic stuff still on the web site: When you purchase a Myki Pass online, the default selection is Zone 1 to Zone 1, which would also be the most popular option. Leaving that default returns an error: This myki pass is not available at this time. Please select another and try again.

What does that error mean? It’s because since 2015 you’ve had to buy Zone 1+2 (for the same price). Why not either tell you that, or automatically change the selection?

The same page has a “Which zones do I need to travel in?” link. This goes to a PDF with another link in it, to a page which doesn’t actually tell you anything about which zones you need to travel in.

Oh well, at least they got rid of the compulsory (and often unwanted) Myki machine receipts .

What else would you fix?

• Remember, fares go up on 1st January. If you use Myki Pass and want to beat the price rise, buy a Pass before then. Your card can hold your current Pass and your next Pass.

Share this:

By Daniel Bowen

Transport blogger / campaigner and spokesperson for the Public Transport Users Association / professional geek. Bunurong land, Melbourne, Australia. Opinions on this blog are all mine.

26 replies on “Ten years of Myki in Melbourne”

1. Roll out to Echuca, Maryborough and Ararat where reservations and first class are not an issue.

2. Allow use on SkyBus.

I think the ticket inspector types make use of the different beeps for cards types. I used to see lines of uniforms listening for the double beep and asking to see concession cards at Melbourne Central. It’s the only way I figured out what it meant.

Although not directly related to today’s article, fare evasion remains a big problem on the metropolitan network, especially on the buses.

Take a ride on any bus route and notice the number of people who simply don’t touch on.

Even fewer seem to touch off.

Myki expiry is a bugbear of mine. It’s nowhere on the card and catches you by surprise. The process of swapping over your Myki at a station is fairly quick, but you need to set up your automatic top ups all over again.

what does de-scoped mean?

It is rare that I use a machine to top up a Myki but I had to for a niece recently. Mikey Money or Mikey Pass? I didn’t really know and went for Money and that was correct, but how is a novice supposed to know?

How about rolling out Myki mobile for concession users?

First off, I repeat what both points expressed by Keven above, and, what Chris said above about the expiry date. MUST be printed on the ticket.

Also, all of the points expressed by yourself above too.

I will add,

*** COVERAGE AREA *** ++ Having MyKi valid across all of V/Line trains, even if they are just for second class passengers, and/or just for the D car only?

++ Why not on V/Line coaches too, especially some areas like South Gippsland, and more?

*** ONLINE AREA **** ++ The online area, needs to have, ‘do I have enough for’ and, where my myki funds are not enough, ‘how much must I add for this trip’ too.

++ The ability to land directly on the website, without the need to navigate around the http://www.ptv.gov.au website.

*** THE FARES ***

++ Introduction of a short trip ticket, with increments of 2, 4 and 6 stations on most train lines

++ Introduce local zones similar to the old neighbourhood system. That shall cover most travellers.

++ Fares charged at hourly increments, with higher costs for peak hour vs off peak hour. Similar to today, you pay for the four most expensive hours in that day.

@Jen – I think Myki Mobile is available for concession users. I have a Seniors mobile myki on my phone, which is great, because I mostly use it on the weekend when metropolitan travel is free. According to https://www.ptv.vic.gov.au/tickets/myki/mobile-myki/mobile-myki-frequently-asked-questions/#eligibility Full fare, Child, Senior or General concession mobile myki are available.

Having to pay $6 for a new card – outrageous

You can use Myki on the V/Line coach between Geelong and Jan Juc – surely wouldn’t be too difficult to extend to Apollo Bay? And would make sense for it to be on the South Gippsland coaches, and the rest of the V/Line train network as well. Yes, first class and reservations might be an issue, but it could handle economy no worries? You already use Myki when travelling in the commuter band on long-haul services, and there are carriages for passengers without a reservation (including Myki).

It would be good to have the Rail+2 reintroduced – surely that’s not too difficult for Myki to handle. Not sure about the old neighbourhoods, though – would add more complexity to the system. Off-peak charging could also work – and Myki already has it for V/Line services.

The V/Line fare anomalies need to go. These might require more work within the Myki system, but some can be fixed just by changing the charging – if the Government insists that travel into Zone 2 from Zone 1 is free, the same benefit should be extended to those travelling right across Zone 2 into Zone 3 and beyond. And the other way around – travel into Zone 1 from Zone 2 only costs $1.40. If you touch on in Zone 1, you should automatically get a Zone 1/2 Myki product if you touch off within Zone 1 – sounds like the passes do it (only because the Zone 1/1 option isn’t available). With Lara straddling Zones 2/3/4, the fare to travel between Geelong and Melbourne should be the total of a Zone 4 and Zone 1 fare ($6.80), not the premium $13.40 in peak.

@Paul, in some cases there might be no need to touch on/off on a bus. For example, if you’re connecting from a train and your bus is in the same zone, then when you touch off at the train station you’ve already paid your fare for the journey. You can touch on and off on the bus and you’ll be charged $0 if it’s within the 2 hours.

Can you really use Mobile Myki availability as a reason not to provide other single use tickets – even if it was avilable for iPhones, how many Android phones out there have the required NFC hardware to make it work? Of the bottom end ~$200 phones I’ve seen, none have it.

@Jordon, the Authorised Officers (ticket inspectors) use the lights on the gates to highlight concessions. They don’t use the double beeps, which in any case go off for Commuter Club ticketholders too, who don’t require concession cards.

@parker, descoped = removed from the scope, eg cancelled.

@Dan, when you say “new” – are you aware that you can get an existing/expired card replaced for free? https://www.ptv.vic.gov.au/tickets/refunds-compensation-and-replacement-tickets/replace-a-ticket/

@number, even if the travel is included in an existing fare, that’s not really an excuse for not touching-on. I suspect they need to declare buses are now operating like trams, allow people to board at any door, and do more random ticket checks.

@Marcus, I don’t think it completely removes the need for single use tickets, but providing phone app or other methods (even if limited to phones with specific features such as NFC) reduces the need.

No mention on the fare increases every year without fail and without a review? Who gives them the right?

Android app isn’t great. Tapping on older terminals are unreliable at best. I found out the hard way, if your phone dies, your myki isn’t backed up on Google Pay, so you lose the card/balance.

The reason people don’t touch on/off in buses/trams/etc is because they already have a valid ticket. They’re not fare evading.

Moat peoole don’t need to touch off if you’re traveling around Melbourne. Your fare gets deducted next time you touch on. Why slow everyone down?

Why don’t they have myki machines inside the trains like Adelaide? Much cheaper to roll out & maintain.

Spending $100m to make $900m seems excessive. It was a fairly incompetent process from the beginning.

Fare structure is fairly expensive for short rides. Its often much cheaper to drive & pay for parking, e.g. Melbourne Zoo, Melbourne Museum, Scienceworks, City, Footy, etc when you have at least one paying kid in tow.

They should have off peak metro fares, especially on the crowded tram routes, to encourage offpeak travel.

Speaking of free modes – why not allow Early Bird fares for all myki-enabled transport modes in Zones 1+2? It really isn’t fair on people who have missed out on free trips for well over a decade simply because the mode of transport offered in their area isn’t an electric Metro train. There is absolutely no difference between touching on a myki at Dandenong station or at Tarneit station or a DART bus at Doncaster or the 75 tram outside the East Burwood Kmart – all of these are in Zone 2 and only differ by the service operator and the vehicles used. In fact, probably more than half the people I see on buses don’t even bother touching on in the early morning because they know the connecting train is free, and having to pay for the ten-minute trip to the nearest Metro station defeats the purpose of the free trip.

Examples: Melton, Doncaster, Templestowe, Warrandyte, Bundoora, Donvale, Vermont, Wantirna, Rowville, Montrose, Mount Evelyn, Kilsyth, Chirnside Park, Wattle Park, Deer Park, Mill Park, Maribyrnong, Somerville, Somerton, Mornington (twenty is enough I think)

@Chris: We used to have off-peak fares in the Metcard era but I think they were canned when myki took over. Note that the single trip fares were also dropped at the same time, with myki fares being equivalent to a single trip of the discounted 10x 2-hour and 5x daily fares. City Saver fares were another thing which vanished around the same time I think (City Saver was basically CBD plus Richmond/North Melbourne, cheaper than a Zone 1; I think it may have been for (Connex/Metro) trains only like the Early Bird tickets but I can’t remember).

I tried using Google pay for my Myki and after holding up far too many fellow computers at the gates at Flagstaff due to speed and reliability issues.. I’ve gone back to a card. Nice in concept.. the real life experience is poor.

I think making users pay $6 for their initial card needs to be scrapped. The Ventra Smartcard in Chicago initially costs $5 but is credited in travel money once registered online, so effectively free. Keeps waste/surplus mykis down whilst encouraging registration and by extension, auto top up and expiry notifications

I think the fare structure around short trips needs to be reviewed. That it costs the same to go 5 stops on a tram as it does to go from Cranbourne to CBD on a train is wrong and encourages fare evasion for short tram trips (also hurting myki data reliability)

The ‘touch off’ instruction needs be clarified to users. There is ZERO reason for any suburban commuter to touch off UNLESS the entire journey is in zone two. Every night, queues form at train stations as people wait to touch off, when this is completely unnecessary unless there are gates. I think the reason for the ‘touch off’ instruction by PTV is purely for data collection purposes

Single use tickets need to be available for people who don’t have nfc compatible smartphones and don’t have a contactless debit/credit card. Also overseas/interstate travellers etc who may not have mobile data to set up a virtual nfc card

Contrary to the people above, I was using the mobile myki on a Samsung A8 with almost no issues. Battery life on your device can be an issue late at night. You do have to hold your phone to the old readers for a significantly longer time than a regular myki

Touching on and off should give really good data on travelling patterns to help improve the system (wishful thinking, I know). I’ll always touch on, but won’t touch off if it isn’t to my advantage to do so (regional anomalies again mean it is sometimes cheaper not to, even considering default fares). Regional default fares rely on the V/Line conductor setting it for outbound trips (at least if you get on at a suburban station – not sure what the default setting is on the Myki gates to the regional platforms at Southern Cross – does anyone know? Inbound, it’s the trip to Zone 1 – I tried it at Geelong once) – and I reckon in recent times my Myki has been checked only about 50% of the time. Inbound in the evening returning, touching off at Sunshine gives me a daily Zone 2/3/4 – touching on again for the Zone 1 part of my trip to West Footscray, I just let the default Zone 1/2 fare do it’s magic rather than touch off – I’ve already got a Zone 2 product, so it takes $3.00 off the Zone 1/2 fare, meaning I only pay $1.40 rather than $4.40.

Re the City Saver, I think there was one you could use on any mode in the City Saver area (although not completely sure about buses), which was different to the short trip (two sections) or rail+2. I used to use the Rail+2 when I lived in East Melbourne over 20 years ago – West Richmond to Flagstaff.

All good points made here and in the comment section.

Some other points: Zone 1-only fares: This is a disadvantage for most inner-city commuters since they were abolished. It makes long trips quite cheap but short trips rather pricey.

Short-Trip fares: I know these were abolished under Metcard but with the current technology, surely it is feasible to re-implement it these days…

@Beano – Agreed.

@Heihachi_73 – City Saver was available on Buses (barring National Bus Company routes, IIRC) and Trams as well.

@Steve Gelsi – The Rail + 2 was the rail version of the Short-Trip fares for Trams. The City Saver differed in that you could only use it in the area, where Rail + 2 could be used anywhere on the system…

– Android/Google Pay Myki cannot be transferred if your phone is lost, stolen or had to be factory reset unless you do that in advance (because of course you’d know that in advance). You need to set up an entirely new card in Google Pay.

– Android/Google Pay Myki funds can only be transferred to a new Android Myki card manually by Myki customer service, and only if registered to a Myki account. Can’t be done via Google Pay itself which is ridiculous.

– Android/Google Pay Myki often crashes and doesn’t read following the first swipe an auto-top up. Need to revert back to my old physical card at those times so the growing queue behind me don’t ark up.

– New Opal cards are free. Myki should be the same. You pay what you load onto it.

– mobile-friendly site is ridiculously overdue

I think the placement of touch on/off machines needs some consideration. In the new skyrail stations, the machines are at ground level – some seem to have gates and some don’t. That means it is entirely possible to sail through the open gates without touching on (which I have done – it’s easy to do when you are thinking about something else at the time). Then up you go to the platform, see the train approaching, realise you haven’t touched on – what do you do? – go down to the concourse and miss your train or jump on without touching on? It there were some machines on the platform you could still touch on and not miss the train. I note that on some of the older raised train lines the machines are on the platform (e.g Canterbury).

I’m not sure whether the MTA in New York does this anymore, but when I was there in 2013, there were the striped magnetic cards that pop out of the ticket machines, which I can refill. And I remember single-use Myki-activated paper tickets being issued when I rode the bus in Ballarat in 2009. Perhaps the following may be one solution:

– Reinstate/continue said paper-tickets as temporary Myki recharge cards for those single users who show up at the door/stop/station. – Charge $1 for those that switch from temporary paper to permanent plastic to partially cover costs. Alternately, paper tickets can be made ineligible for any further discounts beyond eligibility for concession fares. (The latter is what Sydney’s Opal do with paper tickets.) – For those that get the permanent plastic card charged straight away, then they get the card free like Opal, and can get further discounts like off-peak (inc early bird), round trip, counter-peak (basically away from CBD in AM, towards CBD in PM), or short-distance (say less than 2-3km) travel.

Agree with the comment about the placement of Myki readers. Yes in a best-practice world you would always touch on when entering the station (and you are forced to when there are gates) but I think there would be some benefit in also having the ability to touch on (or off) on each platform. Simple station layouts with two platforms at ground level have that anyway. At Geelong, the station staff keep reminding people via PA messaging to remember to touch on before crossing the footbridge to the island platforms 2 & 3. At West Footscray, I imagine the new platform will have its own readers, not sure where but maybe also on the concourse.

On the other side, examples like Caulfield and Footscray, where you may want to interchange between platforms – you can’t seamlessly do that compared to somewhere like Richmond, South Yarra or the City Loop stations.

[…] (I still think they should scrap the 7-Day Pass in favour of a 7-Day Cap, to reduce confusion and purchase risk for the passenger. It would also help shift more people from individual purchases to Auto Topup.) […]

Comments are closed.

• Melbourne Tourism
• Melbourne Hotels
• Melbourne Guest House
• Melbourne Holiday Homes
• Melbourne Flights
• Melbourne Restaurants
• Melbourne Attractions
• Melbourne Travel Forum
• Melbourne Photos
• Melbourne Map
• All Melbourne Hotels
• Melbourne Hotel Deals
• Last Minute Hotels in Melbourne
• Things to Do
• Restaurants
• Holiday homes
• Travel Stories
• Add a Place
• Travel Forum
• Travellers' Choice
• Help Centre

Myki - no single trip tickets? - Melbourne Forum

• South Pacific    
• Australia    
• Victoria    
• Melbourne    

Myki - no single trip tickets?

• India Forums
• United States Forums
• Europe Forums
• Canada Forums
• Asia Forums
• Central America Forums
• Africa Forums
• Caribbean Forums
• Mexico Forums
• South Pacific Forums
• South America Forums
• Middle East Forums
• Honeymoons and Romance
• Business Travel
• Train Travel
• Traveling With Disabilities
• Tripadvisor Support
• Solo Travel
• Bargain Travel
• Timeshares / Holiday Rentals
• Victoria forums
• Melbourne forum

The announcement about the future of Myki stated that it was planned to "eliminat[e] to the extent possible the introduction of disposable short-term cards". See

http://www.ptua.org.au/2011/07/13/myki-must-work-for-users/#more-2440

One hopes that someone brings it to their attention that visitors from other states and overseas have to use their transport system - not just local commuters.

This topic has been closed to new posts due to inactivity.

• Any recommendations for tour? 07:23
• Virtual antarctica in Melbourne 06:33
• Credit card surcharge 04:28
• Hotel Recommendations 3 Adults in November 06 April 2024
• southern light in Melbourne? 06 April 2024
• Melbourne to Briars (HP Experience) Best Route Help 06 April 2024
• 8 days Melbourne trip 05 April 2024
• Sofitel or Next Hotel Melbourne? 05 April 2024
• Melbourne cup 05 April 2024
• Parking near Supreme Court 05 April 2024
• Tram Timings 03 April 2024
• A few hours in Melbourne 01 April 2024
• Need help with 3 days family trip to Melbourne in April 30 March 2024
• Trip Report: EV road trip - Final part 29 March 2024
• Self Drive the Great Ocean Road and Phillip Island 34 replies
• Best place to exchange AUD dollars into USA dollars in Melb 9 replies
• Tips On Best Things To Do in 5 Days(Melbourne) 15 replies
• jetbay parking beware 57 replies
• parking a campervan 3 replies
• Restaurants open Good Friday 3 replies
• Best neighborhood/area to stay 7 replies
• Off Peak Season to Melbourne 4 replies
• Melbourne to Sydney Great Ocean Road drive in 2 days 5 replies
• Pre-Paid SIM Card in MEL 14 replies

Melbourne Hotels and Places to Stay

• What can I do in Melbourne?
• Where should I stay?
• I'm travelling with young children.....?
• I want to see an AFL match.
• What are my options for seeing the Great Ocean Road
• What is Myki? How do I pay for public transport?
• I don't want to rent a car & self drive, how do I see the popular attractions?
• What else is there to do in Melbourne other than the main tourist attractions?
• Christmas Day in Melbourne
• How & where do I go to see snow?
• Melbourne By 1TraveltheWorld

Watch CBS News

Jack Smith argues "not a single" Trump official has claimed he declared any records personal

By Robert Legare

Updated on: April 3, 2024 / 9:17 AM EDT / CBS News

Washington — Special counsel Jack Smith urged a federal judge to keep a presidential recordkeeping law out of instructions that would be provided to the jury in the classified documents case against former President Donald Trump , according to court documents filed by Smith's team late Tuesday. Prosecutors warned that including the law in the instructions risked jeopardizing the proceedings, and signaled they would appeal the judge's decision if she ruled against them.

Last month, U.S. District Court Judge Aileen Cannon , who is overseeing the case in Florida, asked Smith's and Trump's legal teams to file jury instructions based on two hypothetical scenarios: in one, the president has the authority under the Presidential Records Act (PRA) to categorize any records as personal. Under this scenario, Cannon wrote that "neither a court nor a jury" would have the ability to review the decision, a finding that could nullify much of the special counsel's case against Trump. 

In the other, the jury would be able to examine a record that had been retained by a former president and make a finding that it was either "personal or presidential," under the PRA. Under this scenario, it is possible jurors could find that some official documents were mishandled. 

Federal prosecutors rejected both proposals and wrote Tuesday that the PRA — a 1978 law that manages the maintenance of White House documents produced during each presidency — "should not play any role at trial at all," arguing that Trump's alleged mishandling of classified records occurred after his presidency ended.

Trump and Smith filed separate proposals for jury instructions in the case Tuesday, although a trial date has yet to be set. 

Prosecutors said Tuesday that both of Cannon's hypothetical scenarios "rest on an unstated and fundamentally flawed legal premise." Any jury instructions that include the PRA risked "distort[ing] the trial," they said.  

Instead, the special counsel suggested jurors should only have to determine three elements of the case that amount to whether Trump willfully retained national defense information without the authorization of the federal government. 

Smith's team requested that if the judge opts to include language concerning the PRA, she affords them ample time to appeal the matter to higher courts ahead of trial. 

The former president's legal team took the opposite view, writing Cannon "correctly stated the law" when she suggested the jury instruction that would have granted Trump much broader power under the PRA. 

"If this case is presented to a jury—which it should not be—the jury would be forced to resolve factual issues relating to not only PRA categorizations but also documents' alleged classification status," Trump's defense team argued in their filing . 

In their own proposed jury instructions , Trump's legal team suggested Cannon tell jurors that Trump was authorized to access the classified records during his presidency and that certain precedents allow for former presidents to access certain documents. 

The special counsel charged Trump in a 40-count indictment that includes 32 alleged violations of a national security law that makes it illegal to mishandle national defense information. The former president is also accused of engaging in an obstruction scheme as part of an alleged effort to thwart federal investigators as they probed his retention of documents with classified markings. The FBI ultimately recovered over 300 sensitive government records from Trump's Mar-a-Lago residence that prosecutors accused him of illegally keeping. 

Trump pleaded not guilty to all counts and has denied any wrongdoing. 

Tuesday's late-night filing from the special counsel contended that the question of presidential versus private records under the PRA is not a question for a jury because it doesn't apply to Trump's alleged conduct. Instead, prosecutors said this was a matter of law that should be left up to the judge. 

Trump's legal team has filed a number of motions to dismiss the case against him, including one on the grounds that the PRA granted Trump "unreviewable discretion" over classified records.

"President Trump was still the President of the United States when, for example, many of the documents at issue were packed (presumably by the GSA), transported, and delivered to Mar-A-Lago," they wrote in a February court filing. 

Attorneys for the former president also argued that the PRA "precludes judicial review" over a president's recordkeeping, contending that the court has no jurisdiction in the matter, language that was reflected in Cannon's order asking for input on the proposed jury instructions. 

Smith's team, however, pushed back in responding court filings, writing that the more than 300 documents with classified markings recovered from Trump "are indisputably presidential, not personal." 

"Trump was not authorized to possess classified records at all," prosecutors said. 

The federal probe into Trump's handling of classified records followed a months-long effort by federal officials to collect what they said were missing documents. Investigators ultimately executed a search warrant at his Florida residence and club, Mar-a-Lago, in August of 2022, after the former president allegedly failed to fully respond to a grand jury subpoena. 

In Tuesday's filing, Smith's team again pushed back, alleging that Trump's use of the PRA — namely the claim that he had the power to declare certain government documents as personal in nature — was "invented" as a "fictional" defense for his alleged conduct only after the federal probe was underway. The special counsel said neither communications with his defense team throughout the investigation nor witness testimony backs up Trump's claims. 

Prosecutors revealed that during its grand jury investigation, the special counsel's office interviewed individuals close to the former president, including his chiefs of staff and top White House lawyers.  

"Not a single one had heard Trump say that he was designating records as personal or that, at the time he caused the transfer of boxes to Mar-a-Lago, he believed that his removal of records amounted to designating them as personal under the PRA," according to the special counsel. "To the contrary, every witness who was asked this question had never heard such a thing."

In response to Cannon's order, however, Trump's lawyers reiterated their contention that the former president was shielded from prosecution under the PRA. 

"There is no basis for the Special Counsel's Office, this Court, or a jury to second-guess President Trump's document-specific PRA categorizations." 

Cannon has yet to rule on any of Trump's motions to dismiss the indictment, and the former president's legal team urged her again on Tuesday to rule in his favor. Two of the former president's aides, Walt Nauta and Carlos de Oliveira, also face charges in the case and filed their own motions, which also remain unresolved. Nauta and de Oliveira pleaded not guilty to allegations that they worked with the former president to obstruct the federal probe.

The judge has yet to set a trial date in the case — originally scheduled for late May — and has not issued any order related to a request from Smith that she reconsider a ruling tied to protected witness names. She held a hearing on those two issues on March 1.

Trump originally argued that a trial should not go forward before the fall election, but conceded that August would be feasible, should the judge decide to proceed. The special counsel pushed for the trial to begin in July, a proposal that seems less likely to be adopted, since Cannon's docket still contains several unresolved motions. 

• Donald Trump

Robert Legare is a CBS News multiplatform reporter and producer covering the Justice Department, federal courts and investigations. He was previously an associate producer for the "CBS Evening News with Norah O'Donnell."

More from CBS News

Trump sues judge in "hush money" trial in effort to delay it

Biden could miss the deadline for the November ballot in Ohio

Trump says abortion should be left up to states, despite calls for federal ban

Justice Dept rejects House GOP bid to get audio of Biden interview